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RepubCarrier
(@repubcarrier)
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A months or two ago, I became intruiged by the reports of reputable bb.com and BN members who had taken the plunge and started using X-Factor. They all, surprisingly, saw amazing results in terms of muscle increase and fatloss that I could not dismiss due to the critical/skeptical nature of these 15 or so posters. I was without the cash to layout for a $100 X-factor cycle, so with the help of some other schemers on bb.com, I found what I believe to be the best way to replicate an X-factor trial without actually buying X-factor. The key information presented by the "scheming" on bb.com involved finding foods which were high in arachidonic acid, very low in EPA/DHA, and low in cost/annoyance-of-preparation. Egg yolks were suggested, and dismissed, due to DHA content (~1g AA and 250mg DHA per 1/2 lb egg yolk). Undessicated liver was next, but this was dismissed due to unpalatability, unavailability, and cost (except for the Greek poster, Bane. I dont know what became of that). The discussion then veered elsewhere... most notably to this study:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...71&query;_hl=27

Docosahexaenoic acid-enriched egg consumption induces accretion of arachidonic acid in erythrocytes of elderly patients.

Payet M, Esmail MH, Polichetti E, Le Brun G, Adjemout L, Donnarel G, Portugal H, Pieroni G.

INSERM U476, Faculte de Medecine, 27 Bd Jean Moulin, 13385 Marseille cedex 05, France.

Many studies in humans volunteers have shown that dietary docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) supplied as triacylglycerol can increase DHA levels in blood lipids but often strongly decreases those of arachidonic acid (AA). The aim of the present study was to determine the effect of dietary supplementation with egg-yolk powder enriched in DHA, corresponding to the French recommended dietary allowance for DHA, on the blood lipid status of an elderly population. Institutionalised elderly individuals aged between 63 and 93 years consumed an egg product enriched in DHA (150 mg/d) once daily for 9 months. Plasma lipids and the fatty acid composition of erythrocyte membranes were determined every 3 months. The supplementation induced an increase in the PUFA content of plasma and erythrocyte membranes which was +14.5 and +25.3 %, respectively, at 9 months. This effect was mainly due to the level of DHA and, unexpectedly, to that of AA which continuously increased. This increase in AA was the result of an increased dietary intake (+50 mg/d) and very probably of an increased biosynthesis as demonstrated by the behaviour of di-homo-gamma-linolenic acid. The supplementation resulted in a blood PUFA status comparable with that of young healthy controls. The data are consistent with a strong regulatory action of the dietary treatment on the subjects' lipid metabolism.

Not only is DHA not an antagonist of AA, as is EPA, it actually increases its serum levels and incorporation into tissues! This means that egg yolks were actually a better choice for the DHA.

1/2 pound of egg yolk has approximately 1g AA, as mentioned before; just how many egg yolks is this? I forget what calculations I did, but it came out to 9-10 jumbo eggs or 12-13 large eggs. A dozen egg yolks a day, minus EPA/anti-inflammatories. This is Egg-Factor™.

I am well aware that strength athletes for centuries have consumed a dozen (or more) whole eggs, gallons of milk, and pounds of beef per day, so this is not an entirely novel idea. **I am also aware that Prolangtum eats up to 18 whole eggs per day when bulking**. But, it gives us a bit more direction than "just house everything in sight" which is especially relevant when cutting; for example, the egg whites are not critical and were not eaten very often.

I had only two people willing to commit to this "experiment": myself and someone I lift with. We did not consciously try to do anything different with our diets (i.e. cut, bulk, eat cleaner, drink less alcohol) other than add the egg yolks (and whites if we felt like it) and subtract fish oil and NSAID use. I acknowledge that this doesn't have statistical power, and even if it does, doesnt prove anything about egg yolk consumption; maybe stopping fish oil alone would have produced results, maybe the consumption of egg yolk prevented consumption of some other insidious food, etc. But, the results do warrant me recommending that other people try this out regardless of knowing exactly why it works at this time (pending Bill's X-factor study?).

I dropped out of this experiment 12 days ago when I started experiencing sickness, was not gaining weight or reducing fat, and just felt unwell in general. A few days ago I confirmed a case of infectious mononucleosis ("mono") which clearly was a confounding variable. On to my friend. He is 19, 25-30% bodyfat, 265 pounds. A few days in, we both experienced explosive flatulence (funny, I suppose, but expected). About 10 days in, he started commenting that he thought he looked "fuller". Over the next week, he experienced unusual soreness from workouts and continued commenting that he looked fuller even when he wasnt working out. The next week, I noticed that he looked a lot leaner and "fuller" as he had been describing himself. The next week (this past week) this effect continued, and my friend repeated every workout "this arachidonic acid thing is working pretty good I think".

I don't want to pretend that this was an experiment, it was just something that produced an apparent leanness I had not seen in my friend since 2 years ago when he weighed 215. He commented "I haven't seen a vein in this bicep since I did all that running (and weighed 215)". If anybody has followed the supposed effects that X-factor has (that my friend did not know beforehand), he has exhibited them all.

I am definetely going to try this out next winter, or maybe a little sooner, but I just wanted to share this idea and the scientific basis for me substituting it in place of X-factor. If there are any critiques or questions, scientific or practical, feel free to post.


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eclypz
(@eclypz)
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Very interesting...

and not only does it bring to the table a conversation about muscle building but a general discussion of inflammation.

I may have to try something like this... For a short period...

I'm wondering what TTA and GPA would add to this.

Then again, any sort of regimen that increases this inflammation might be in need some anabolics to take advantage of the responsiveness to inflammation that they bring. I would try to stick with something least interuptive to hpta balance(simply for the holistic nature). Something like Anavar would be very intriguing...

eclypz signature


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RepubCarrier
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Posted by: @eclypz
Very interesting...

and not only does it bring to the table a conversation about muscle building but a general discussion of inflammation.

I may have to try something like this... For a short period...

I'm wondering what TTA and GPA would add to this.

Then again, any sort of regimen that increases this inflammation might be in need some anabolics to take advantage of the responsiveness to inflammation that they bring. I would try to stick with something least interuptive to hpta balance(simply for the holistic nature). Something like anavar would be very intriguing...

I think Bill has commented on X-factor (and by extension, this) likely being synergistic with androgen use, but it's certainly not necessary (theoretically).

From what I understand, GPA would not interfere with this at all, positively or negatively.

TTA might present a similar problem that sesathin/fish oil/NSAIDs do:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.f...l=pubmed_docsum

However, I don't actually understand why any of this avoiding anti-inflammatories recommendation is valid. So long as there is a large amount of AA present pre-workout, and not very much EPA/NSAIDs/TTA to block it's metabolic cascade, the anabolic effects should happen. EPA/NSAIDs/TTA could be used on off-days or far away from workouts. Bill has never said this would work, but its certainly a more balanced approach that makes sense according to his own research.


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trouble
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I can verify personally the production of arachadonates from two sources:

soy nut butter and hazelnut macadamia nut spreads.

Holy shit. Let's say that I have a propensity towards reduced control of arachadonate production when the precursor is present from dietary sources.

These sources, even in modest single servings, when used over a period of days, resulted in elevated production of exactly the arachadonic acid and its metabolites - even when EPA and DHA were present in the diet.

And yeah, I don't have much difficulty putting on muscle mass.


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omnibus
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Funny thing, I just started eating a lot of whole eggs again. I always saw my best gains with a lot of eggs in my diet. Right now I'm eating about 15 eggs. Let's see how long I can keep this up, I tend to get sick of them after a while.

Interesting stuff.


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Kimbo
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Several places offer whole egg powder or egg yolk powder - wonder if that would work mixed as a shake? Not that I don't like eggs, I love them... just looking at it from a convenience standpoint.

If someone says something about you, and it really bothers you, it's probably because it's true.


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velikimajmun
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Has anyone tried to source Mortierella alpina oil? I believe that's what X-factor actually is.


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RepubCarrier
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Posted by: @kimboinatl
Several places offer whole egg powder or egg yolk powder - wonder if that would work mixed as a shake?  Not that I don't like eggs, I love them... just looking at it from a convenience standpoint.

I had considered this, but I ultimately decided against it on the basis of cost. The cheapest I've seen egg protien for is ~$25 for 2lbs. We need 1/2 pound of egg yolk per day, so this is roughly $6 per day. This assumes that all of the fat from the yolks is kept in the protein powder, but I highly doubt that is the case; this would necessitate even more consumption of the powder to get the AA and DHA we are looking for. I couldn't find any egg yolk powder with a google search, but I imagine it has that same thing going against it.

If someone had the money, and were looking for convenience, they could try X-factor + DHA pills (without EPA) and see if it works any better than X-factor. This would cost a great deal more than the eggs, which run roughly $1 per day (60 eggs for $4+tax at wholesale stores!) and replace the costs of some amount of food in your diet, since they do have substantial caloric value.


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Kimbo
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Several places offer whole egg powder or egg yolk powder - wonder if that would work mixed as a shake? Not that I don't like eggs, I love them... just looking at it from a convenience standpoint.

If someone says something about you, and it really bothers you, it's probably because it's true.


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velikimajmun
(@velikimajmun)
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Has anyone tried to source Mortierella alpina oil? I believe that's what X-factor actually is.


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RepubCarrier
(@repubcarrier)
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Topic starter  
Posted by: @kimboinatl
Several places offer whole egg powder or egg yolk powder - wonder if that would work mixed as a shake?  Not that I don't like eggs, I love them... just looking at it from a convenience standpoint.

I had considered this, but I ultimately decided against it on the basis of cost. The cheapest I've seen egg protien for is ~$25 for 2lbs. We need 1/2 pound of egg yolk per day, so this is roughly $6 per day. This assumes that all of the fat from the yolks is kept in the protein powder, but I highly doubt that is the case; this would necessitate even more consumption of the powder to get the AA and DHA we are looking for. I couldn't find any egg yolk powder with a google search, but I imagine it has that same thing going against it.

If someone had the money, and were looking for convenience, they could try X-factor + DHA pills (without EPA) and see if it works any better than X-factor. This would cost a great deal more than the eggs, which run roughly $1 per day (60 eggs for $4+tax at wholesale stores!) and replace the costs of some amount of food in your diet, since they do have substantial caloric value.


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Kimbo
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Posted by: @RepubCarrier
Several places offer whole egg powder or egg yolk powder - wonder if that would work mixed as a shake?  Not that I don't like eggs, I love them... just looking at it from a convenience standpoint.

I had considered this, but I ultimately decided against it on the basis of cost. The cheapest I've seen egg protien for is ~$25 for 2lbs. We need 1/2 pound of egg yolk per day, so this is roughly $6 per day. This assumes that all of the fat from the yolks is kept in the protein powder, but I highly doubt that is the case; this would necessitate even more consumption of the powder to get the AA and DHA we are looking for. I couldn't find any egg yolk powder with a google search, but I imagine it has that same thing going against it.

If someone had the money, and were looking for convenience, they could try X-factor + DHA pills (without EPA) and see if it works any better than X-factor. This would cost a great deal more than the eggs, which run roughly $1 per day (60 eggs for $4+tax at wholesale stores!) and replace the costs of some amount of food in your diet, since they do have substantial caloric value.

What about this?

Protein Factory egg yolk powder

Granted, it's PF ... but it's only $4.39/lb. I figure based on fat content 45g would be equivalent to 6 eggs. That's about 10 servings per lb, so about $.44 a serving...

If someone says something about you, and it really bothers you, it's probably because it's true.


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Derek
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Perhaps we could persuade Bill's biggest fan (aka Mike) to get some egg yolk powder and run a special with some DHA caps.


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velikimajmun
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Posted by: @Derek
Perhaps we could persuade Bill's biggest fan (aka Mike) to get some egg yolk powder and run a special with some DHA caps.

It'd be better (especially from a caloric standpoint) to see if he could source Mortierella alpina oil, its 40% AA and should be readily available as it is what they use to supplement baby formulas.


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Derek
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Sure, fine, do it the smart way.


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